2011 Fiesta 1.4i Heating issues

[Handy Andy]

Um... why haven’t I heard of this test mode and how do I access it?

Go here...Ford Fiesta MK7 hidden menu - mr-fix.info (mr-fix.info)

This site introduces you to the button, thru the use of it in an MK7 - although it is not complete, it can show you the various steps to engage the button, then you can push the button a set number of times to arrive to a spot in it's test mode, allowing you to view what the vehicle dash "sees".

Then go Here.. What to Know Before Buying | Ford Fiesta Forum

Some of the menu displays are informational results, like sensors, others are "results" from Sensor input - like Fuel Gage - Fuel Pressure and Fuel Level - so the analog gauges and what they display, to Digital input, as a form of calibration - can be checked.

Also there is a "dual" system (I think - don't quote me) used to determine Throttle Position to actual Throttle location - a dual "sweep" mode that is about 17 presses into this test Menu. Another set of presses past that brings you to a "Temp" screen measured in "C" Centigrade - which matches the Coolant Temp sensor reading - or the "Bargraph" dummy-idiot display of where the needle for the Temp Gauge" and "Are you Warmed Up Enough Yet?" questions that arise while driving.

There's the typical TACH which you can compare the Digital to your Analog and even see kM/Hr and use it to help calibrate the Speedo - then there seems to be a section in it that shows a result of wheel diameter - again don't quote me but there's information that even can show DTC or pending's which if none, would say "NONE".

There is even one I've found that shows a "vacuum" hexadecimal result off of the MAP/MAF combo sensor to show the drop in engine vacuum thru the "A" (Auxiliary monitor - various modules in the system it looks at) and "P" (PCM) ports showing their results - you can play with the menu to find areas of interest for yourself - as far as any changes? No, they won't let you make any changes - but at least you can scroll thru the menu list to find the more important functions and help you in troubleshooting.

 

[Handy Andy]

is there a way to burp the dead spot to make sure that no air is in that section? the reservoir i have has these semi hard lines from the back of the engine to the coolant tank and from the radiator to the coolant tank

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Well, the location of that "burp hose" is at the rear exhaust side of the motor - towards rear firewall, and back towards Brake Booster - a line comes off the head back there and routes following the Heater hose, Evap canister tube routing then past the 4-Coil head - it makes a sharp turn towards the fuel rail then up to the reservoir - recovery tank.

Remove the coolant cap - and start the motor then see if the coolant - as the engine warms up - will try to push thru this smaller hose into the recovery tank. It is detachable but not recommended unless you feel the plugging is severe enough for you to make it necessary and remove the hose and drop down the hose to see if fluid will siphon off or even if the line can even drain from back there.

Note! It does have a metal tube that routes out from the rear of the Exhaust-side of the cylinder head - if it's kinked or plugged, there's you're ballgame.

In the above,
The tube outlet for this burp line is buried but you can see it's metal,
going to a flexible hose, then to a RIGID plastic line.​

It is my fear that the rear hose may be plugged or kinked - slowing down the escape of hot fluid, bubbles or combination of both. Age and environment conditions add a level of concern for the extended life coolant can fail to keep the corrosion elements like calcification and oil dissolution to a minimum

 

[Handy Andy]

Further Emphasis

PDF of this DOC, attached.
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[Ashlan]

I "sight it in" - look across the top of the intake side of the motor - like you're looking for "clearance" and level you'll see that line and how it routes from that back corner - towards the front then onto the Fuel rail bar clips - then up - at an angle - to the reservoir - with the "nipple" being below the seam - immersed in fluid.

If the hose is going to the wrong side of the seam, upper versus lower, plugged, or not properly positioned (kinked) - or you lack fluid, that can cavitate and pull air into the motor instead of the fluid. causing the pocket. A leak near the bottom of the motor or a weak cylinder head gasket can also push air into the head this way and force a building of pressure faster than it can remove it, potentially bursting the system

I had an old Chevy that needed a similar setup to keep a rear air pocket from forming so they routed it as a heater hose with a branch or fork off of it to do the same thing - pull out the air pocket to return to the top of the radiator and another hose routes to circulate in the water pump -

If you look at the picture attached, B, comes from the radiator and is used to self bleed the system and A, to my understanding is the pipe you're talking about that runs along the fuel rail from behind the engine. I've checked the pipe and its flows freely however the layout of the pipes has always been as shown in the image. My fluid is not exactly on max as im parked on an incline.

My radiator cap was worn, i replaced it today and i'm getting temps up to 104°C, i'm gonna run it longer to do a proper test and verify.

BTW, this is the guage i purchased to assist with engine temps as my car does not have a guage. Its pretty neat and it looks awesome. (see picture)

 

[Ashlan]

It may also be a head gasket going bad. Are you smelling coolant at the tailpipe? If you are losing water and cannot find the source this could be it. Losing water at the cylinders will cause overheating.

None, Car isn't loosing coolant

 

[Handy Andy]

I like how you did that, that is a KEWL little gauge...

Can that be expanded, like scroll or something to show status of say, Oil, Temp (you have now) and Vacuum/Boost? (Add on sensors?)

Yes, A to the top, B line to the bottom - for if they get switched, then it can cavitate into the system - in this setup it's highly unlikely because of their size, type of connector - used on both, makes that difficult -but in this day and age, I've seen a lot...just need to keep it (Coolant) between the Min and Max lines.

You raise an interesting point though, if you were parked on inclines - and depending on the slope of that incline, you may find air pockets forming because it can't avoid the condition. At least it won't leak but coolant itself is supposed to have a non foaming agent in it to keep it from the froth and loosing the ability to be effective - so if it had some miles on it and you developed this problem - wow - I can see parking on an incline and aged coolant - I hope it' isn't the Achilles heel in this situation.

Thanks for taking the time to post this, helps the rest of us - hope the small tweaks work out.

 

[Ashlan]

I like how you did that, that is a KEWL little gauge...

Can that be expanded, like scroll or something to show status of say, Oil, Temp (you have now) and Vacuum/Boost?

Yes, the displays can be adjusted dependant on what the screen picks up on your OBD

 

[Handy Andy]

Yes, the displays can be adjusted dependant on what the screen picks up on your OBD

Love it, got a link to help us find that?

 

[Ashlan]

Love it, got a link to help us find that?

I bought it of a South African online store. But its on Amazon aswell as a konnwei kw206 see link below

https://www.amazon.com/KONNWEI-Automotive-Computer-Speedometer-Temperature/dp/B08GYLXJ1V

 

[Ashlan]

I like how you did that, that is a KEWL little gauge...

Can that be expanded, like scroll or something to show status of say, Oil, Temp (you have now) and Vacuum/Boost? (Add on sensors?)

Yes, A to the top, B line to the bottom - for if they get switched, then it can cavitate into the system - in this setup it's highly unlikely because of their size, type of connector - used on both, makes that difficult -but in this day and age, I've seen a lot...just need to keep it (Coolant) between the Min and Max lines.

You raise an interesting point though, if you were parked on inclines - and depending on the slope of that incline, you may find air pockets forming because it can't avoid the condition. At least it won't leak but coolant itself is supposed to have a non foaming agent in it to keep it from the froth and loosing the ability to be effective - so if it had some miles on it and you developed this problem - wow - I can see parking on an incline and aged coolant - I hope it' isn't the Achilles heel in this situation.

Thanks for taking the time to post this, helps the rest of us - hope the small tweaks work out.

Funny enough, at the beginning of the month i had the radiator professionally cleaned and installed new coolant. That coolant is 3 weeks old (2000km). i think the discoloration is due to my temps getting up to 130° not sure how to rectify the situation. My last resort is to change the water pump.

 

[Handy Andy]

i think the discoloration is due to my temps getting up to 130° not sure how to rectify the situation. My last resort is to change the water pump.

Ouch!

IF the mileage isn't excessive, like; more than 75,000 - I would think it should be ok. But then too, a lot of times the coolant changes color, or even fades with time. But this time check is pretty short, and is the coolant even current - stale coolant does have a degradation - I think color is one indication.

Since you're in South Africa, this may mean other issues around how well the flush was done - some cleaners can leave a residue the coolant picks up and may need to be changed at a closer interval.

You can check for a specific gravity (a type of measurement of the fluids ability to suspend the solution as well as be a solution) and see what the hygrometer will show. Most hygrometers for radiators will work - you might want to check and make sure the coolant is not too strong - then that works in reverse, the heat exchange can't take place fast enough - so water needs to be added to help with "wetting" - the wetting agent in the coolant and the change of color - you need to have the solution checked by a SEPARATE shop that can be independent but yet be willing to show you the results.

If you find out the solution is more 70-30% versus 50%-50% grab some deionized (Distilled and purified) water and you'll need to bleed/drain off some of that concentrate to dilute it with the water to help balance the solution. It may also help restore the color.

 

[Ashlan]

I'm currently using Castrol SF Premix coolant as i didn't want to go through the hassle of diluting the coolant and being uncertain as to the ratio within the system. See link below for the coolant i use. https://www.castrol.com/content/dam...en_mm/myanmar/home/pdf/radicool-sf-premix.pdf

 

[Handy Andy]

IF you're not too worried about the color...

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As long as the "phosphorescence" of the coolant is present - they do give a contrasting range of color - and if the specific gravity (hygrometer) shows confirmation of the coolants ability to reduce (not remove) Boil-overs and freeze-points - you're in like Flynn.

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[Ashlan]

Awesome. I need to get myself a hydrometer

 

[Jay26]

Hi Guys

So i've been monitoring my fiesta temps and i noticed its been reaching higher temps than usual.

It reached the overheating light point of 120°C (248F) which is when i decided to change the thermostat + housing ad used new coolant. Now the car averages between 100°c - 117°c (212F - 243F) under load (uphill). This is still higher than the temps i used to see when the car was much younger. (used to average 92°C/198F uphill)

I've change the water pump during my cam belt service at 90 000km (56000miles) and there was nothing wrong with it. it was recommended to be changed while that side of the engine was stripped. i'm now doing 158 000km (98 000 miles). Would it still be my water pump or is my radiator blocked.

Fan still comes on at 105°C (221F) and temperature does fluctuate up and down but at higher values than normal.

Hi, have you sorted out this overheating problem that you're facing? I know it's been awhile but I can't remember if I've posted my situation and solution here previously so I'm gonna do just that in case you're still having the issue.

I was facing the same situ as you were somewhere in early 2021 and it almost made me check myself into a psycho ward! Tried every damn thing, brought it to numerous Ford experts, trawled online hoping for solutions but nothing worked and most of them ford experts were saying I've got a bad headgasket (which I can see no tell tale signs of). After a couple of mths, I gave in and changed the whole damn cooling system including the radiator but of course non of it helped, issue persisted.

At the end, what I did was to drill an additional hole onto the thermostat right next to the jiggle valve (about 1cm to the left of the jiggle valve and the hole is roughly the same size the one on the jiggle valve). Did this about 6 to 9 mths ago and to date, no more higher than normal running temps or overheating incidences. What happened was that the hole on the jiggle valve was too small for it to breathe therefore all flows of the coolant was restricted and this also somehow caused the thermostat from opening up at the preset temp 90% of the time or it did open up but flow is restricted. Anyways, i got the hole drilling idea from a mechanic friend who once did it on a Toyota (he didn't recommend it on my earlier visits to him as he thought I wouldn't be willing to do smtg like this).

 

[Jay26]

Hi Guys

So i've been monitoring my fiesta temps and i noticed its been reaching higher temps than usual.

It reached the overheating light point of 120°C (248F) which is when i decided to change the thermostat + housing ad used new coolant. Now the car averages between 100°c - 117°c (212F - 243F) under load (uphill). This is still higher than the temps i used to see when the car was much younger. (used to average 92°C/198F uphill)

I've change the water pump during my cam belt service at 90 000km (56000miles) and there was nothing wrong with it. it was recommended to be changed while that side of the engine was stripped. i'm now doing 158 000km (98 000 miles). Would it still be my water pump or is my radiator blocked.

Fan still comes on at 105°C (221F) and temperature does fluctuate up and down but at higher values than normal.

Hi, have you sorted out this overheating problem that you're facing? I know it's been awhile but I can't remember if I've posted my situation and solution here previously so I'm gonna do just that in case you're still having the issue.

I was facing the same situ as you were somewhere in early 2021 and it almost made me check myself into a psycho ward! Tried every damn thing, brought it to numerous Ford experts, trawled online hoping for solutions but nothing worked and most of them ford experts were saying I've got a bad headgasket (which I can see no tell tale signs of). After a couple of mths, I gave in and changed the whole damn cooling system including the radiator but of course non of it helped, issue persisted.

At the end, what I did was to drill an additional hole onto the thermostat right next to the jiggle valve (about 1cm to the left of the jiggle valve and the hole is roughly the same size the one on the jiggle valve). Did this about 6 to 9 mths ago and to date, no more higher than normal running temps or overheating incidences. What happened was that the hole on the jiggle valve was too small for it to breathe therefore all flows of the coolant was restricted and this also somehow prevented the thermostat from opening up at the preset temp 90% of the time (or maybe it did open up but the flow of coolant is restricted). Anyways, i got the hole drilling idea from a mechanic friend who once did it on a Toyota (he didn't recommend it on my earlier visits to him as he thought I wouldn't be willing to do smtg like this)

 

[Handy Andy]

I wonder if the recommended thermostat - versus the one you got - had two different opening temperatures.

Interesting how the mechanics told you head gasket when you see your temperatures rise...

When the head gasket opens - doesn't mean the temperature suddenly rose - it means the block and head aren't mating right, excessive pressure not necessarily head temperature (which is a factor that causes warpage - but the engine loading problem is not solved - back off that throttle) - you go get out of the car and open that hood and using a THICK rag and heavy gloves - turn the coolant recovery tank cap, back it off a bit, back it off a 1/2 a turn to help release pressure - thats your head gasket bleeding or burping excessive pressure into the cooling system.

If not done, that coolant tank will burst, possibly explode - you'll hear a loud bang - then smell hot fluid - that's it' - it's done - all over the engine compartment - shut it off, tow it to get a new container and rise off the engine compartment, refill - you'll be ok.

• teaches many a lesson in performance and how not to overdo it.
• an Example, but of another car using a similar setup...

Your other issue of excessive heat in the system is due to the thermostat itself and its design.

Which style did you have?

This type?

The thermostat is housed in a "nook" for the water outlet the coolant circulates to the heater but then gets sucked back in - the thermostat, by temperature opening is about 15 degrees F cooler (175-185F) due to the heater hose sucking cooled heat back thru the housing - so you have to run a cooler thermostat in it to open faster at a cooler opening temperature so it would circulate before it overheats.

If not, then perhaps this type...



This one, the thermostat uses and MOUNTS TO the block to obtain temperature - the other unit uses plastic housing - so you know...

 

[Jay26]

The other mechanics diagnosed me with a blown headgasket mostly bcos the coolant in the spare tank keeps boiling and purging coolant while cap is open and engine is idling. During this period, I never travel far from home and I'm careful to not push beyond 3000 rpm before changing gears (mine's a dual clutch manual).

Both the thermostat have the same operating temperature and even if its different, I don't think it'd have been the cause of my overheating issue. Bcos even if different, it would have to open up at the very latest at 105 celcius (when the high speed fan kick on but the thermostat didnt open up then or anytime later). The thermostats are slighty different in design, my old one has got a rounded bottom whereas the new one has got a flat bottom. And of course the old thermostat has got a slightly bigger jiggle valve which is why I Drilled a additional hole on the new thermostat.

Last my thermostat is mounted on the thermostat housing like the one shown in your 2nd picture.

 

[Handy Andy]

As long as you can tolerate this new additional "step".

There were several TSB (Tech SVC Bulletins) regarding the overheat issue, - the bell valve had to be installed in the housing so that air pockets from that boiling and gasket seepage (when the combustibles press past the head and block gap) but they also addressed several other issues around the oil / coolant and leakage condition.

The newer thermostats at least from my 2019 - were 95C opening.

There is more "history" behind the motor...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Duratorq_engine

Read the article and review some of the links you'll find the "overheat" issue and although changes were made, it was a problem similar to the (Dual Clutch) DSP6 fiasco

 

[scotman]

The u.s spec 1.6 fiesta has been a "hot runner"from the very beginning. When i picked up my '11fiesta in July of 2010. I immediately thought that it either was a coolant capacity issue or a lack of airflow!
I had planned to prepare it for a couple seasons of SCCA autocross in STF (street touring front wheel drive). But, when I was looking at coolant temperature during a run it would spike to a level that had me thinking that I should have the heater blower running to help bleed off the boil.
I even went so far as cutting a hood panel to directly improve the airflow, which did help quite a bit.
I like the idea of drilling an additional weep hole in the thermostat! I am replacing the plastic thermostat housing this month because of it's age.
I think the new Stat is getting a hole added. Probably not larger diameter than 7mm.